Question About Oil Change.

Sorry to bring this thread back to my moan the other day...but I promise it's sort of relevant and I felt I simply had to mention that, with another hat on I am new to a 2011 Ford Mondeo 2.0tdci and today attempted an oil change. I was shocked, after a fruitless afternoon deciding whether to take the whole of the car apart to simply get to the oil filter(!) it turns out I need one of these
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B01M3TWQ7J?ref=ppx_pt2_mob_b_prod_image

I mean... actually a spanner made, specifically, to go round corners!
What has the world come to!

 

Not really a satisfactory response from Triumph which does not address the cause. The online Owners Handbook is still issue 1 so has not been updated. So what Triumph seem to be suggesting is to use the handbook original method but if the oil light does not quickly extinguish then resort to the bulletin method, however not everyone is aware of the bulletin as it was only issued to dealers and does not exist in Tritun.

 

I have always checked my oil level cold (rightly or wrongly) to save faffing about for several minutes and I maintain the level at the upper mark on the dipstick with both wheels on level ground and the bike vertical. As you say it is essential that the bike is vertical and not on the side stand to get an accurate reading. This method has always worked for me but it's your decision if you deviate from the manual like I do. With the bike on level ground and on the side stand I remove the dipstick, wipe it clean then replace it screwed right in. I then pull the bike off the side stand so that it is vertical then put it back on the side stand and immediately remove the dipstick again to check the oil level. This works for me as a one man operation without needing assistance.

 

I am pretty sure that my method will always maintain the oil level between the upper and lower dipstick marks whichever way you check it and plus I check on a weekly basis (my bike does not appear to use any oil between oil changes).

 

I think you are making a very dangerous assumption. What makes you think the problem was “so rare”??
If you Google it, you won’t have too much difficulty finding owners whose bikes have been damaged.
Sadly, the response you received was written by an idiot who couldn’t even be bothered to investigate properly and fully explain. Your question was simply unanswered - end of.
Why on earth would you conduct an oil change using a method which could result in an airlock when a recommended alternative exists???
Unfortunately, Triumph USA are not Triumph - they are nothing more than a national distributor for the brand. If you wanted a proper answer, you needed to write to Triumph, as in Triumph U.K., the people who make the bike and who issued the TSB in the first place.
I will contact them and post their response, meanwhile - ignore that gem of “wisdom” you received from Triumph USA - a 5-yr old could have written a more relevant, convincing and coherent response!!!!

 

Totally right.
Triumph would not replace whole engines and make a TSB if it's "nothing to worry about" and thats the only fix.
Personally , I think it's too much of a lottery so i'm getting triumph to do the oil change.
Sure, I can do it of course but if it goes wrong? New engine mr triumph please.
If I do it and it gets an air lock? It’s game over for the bike.

 

But . . . the problem you have here is that it would seem any number of dealers aren’t using the correct method and especially in the USA where even the main importer is in denial.
Assume a scenario . . . You put your bike in to Triumph for an oil change and they do it wrong, fire up the bike and the oil light stays on. . . .
This is what happens next -
After about 15-20 seconds or so, Bloggs realises the oil light is still on and cuts the engine. He might then fire it up again, assuming a faulty pressure sender or may seek advice from a colleague. They eventually realise what the issue is, either without further engine starts or perhaps after a couple more. Your engine will have suffered damage but not terminal - it will still run and you will be none the wiser when you subsequently collect your bike - they aren’t about to tell you for sure!!!!!
2 years down the road and maybe another rogue oil change under your belt, your engine gets rattly, starts burning oil and is generally shagged - do you think Triumph will hold up their hand and concede there was a service issue at any point??? I think there is little chance.
Alternatively, change your oil using the recommended modified technique (which I have now done twice without issue).
If the oil light goes out - all well and good. If it doesn’t (Uber unlikely if you attach an empty filter after filling the bike with oil), at least you will be ready for it and can cut the engine in the first 5 seconds before any damage occurs.m and if necessary, have the dealer fix the issue but. . . . it isn’t going to happen but is almost guaranteed to do so if you entrust your dealer!!
No way will I be letting any dealers change my oil - not a chance.
I have a similar issue with my 1-series BMW which uses “self-destructing” cartridge oil filters which often disintegrate when the top of the filter housing is unscrewed during filter changes. Bits of filter paper and swarf then pass through the housing and on to the galleries resulting in engine failure within 1000 miles or so.
When this happens under warranty, BMW’s fix us to replace the entire housing which is a £1200 job. With my car now out of warranty, there is no way the dealer will pay for this themselves - they will simply fish out the remnants of the broken filter, install the new one and leave me with a knackered car a few months down the line and of course, deny the filter ever broke when they changed it.
If I change it myself and it breaks, the car goes on a trailer, gets taken to BMW and I pay for the work to be done properly in the full knowledge of what has happened to my car

 

Unfortunately you simply haven’t grasped the problem.
The oil filter is downstream of the pump - the latter incorporates a pickup into the sump from which it draws a supply of oil. The airlock forms within the pickup between the oil in the sump and the pump itself. If the filter is left off and the sump filled with oil, the oil ascends the pickup to allow the pump to prime when the engine is started and air is expelled through the filter mounting point prior to then installing the filter.
With the filter installed first - as the engine oil is added, air pressure builds up downstream of the pump and prevents the oil from rising within the pickup, resulting in a possible failure to prime. This whole problem has resulted from a redesign of the sump on the 2018+ Speedy
The problem has nothing to do with an airlock within the crankcase itself.
You are right to ask why the manual hasn’t been updated and we need an answer but I suspect it’s an oversight on behalf of Triumph. No way will they admit to that and so expect some slippery answers from Triumph themselves!!!

 

Hi Guys . . . my sincere apologies for the delay but
a. I forgot and
b. I've been busy staining my house windows before the autumn rains and cooler weather put a halt to progress

Anyway . . this morning I sent the following email to Triumph UK customer services and of course, I will post their response in due course

Dear Sirs,


I would be very grateful if you would clarify an issue for me re my 2019 Speed Triple RS as moving forward, I intend to conduct my own interim oil changes.

I have become aware of an issue with the 1050 engine on this model which requires a modified service procedure in order to facilitate priming of the oil pump after an oil and filter change and I have attached a copy of a Technical Service Bulletin issued by yourselves which explains the new procedure.

The bulletin refers to a "revised handbook oil & filter change procedure" which should be handed to the customer on collection of their motorcycle and suggests that "the handbook will be updated as soon as possible".


I suspect this bulletin was issued in 2018 and my motorcycle was purchased in March of 2020. I received no information from my dealer in respect of the above but furthermore, the handbook which accompanied my motorcycle did not include any revision to the oil change procedure.

Additionally, when I logged on to Tritun and verified the service information for my machine, the procedure has not been modified but instead, simply suggests draining the old oil, replacing the sump plug and primed filter prior to filling the engine with the correct quantity of oil.


As a result of this confusion, I have now spoken to a number of dealers in order to gain clarification as to how I should correctly change the oil on my motorcycle. The responses I have received have ranged from confirmation of the need to use the modified procedure as per your bulletin in addition to complete denial of any knowledge of the existence of the attached bulletin.


I would be very grateful if you would confirm if the attached Service Bulletin has been withdrawn and if not, is a modified owners handbook available and do you still intend to update the service information provided by Tritun?? Clearly, I am concerned my machine might be damaged either by myself or more importantly, when returned to an official dealer for service, should they be unaware of the revised procedure for oil and filter changes.


I look forward to hearing from you in due course,


Yours faithfully


Alan Gilbert

 

Here you go guys . . . this reply from Triumph UK does answer our question but also raises one or two more . . . .

"Dear Mr Gilbert.

Thank you for your enquiry.

Just to make you aware, the document you are in possession of is a confidential document between the factory and our dealers, and should not be in your possession.

It is a technical news and not a service bulletin, and while there is not necessarily anything to hide in them, they may contain information that we wish to control the release of to stop someone getting the wrong end of the stick as so often happens when people are not full aware of all the facts.

As to the subject of your enquiry.

There is no real need to carry out additional oil changes unless the bike is being used in a very harsh environment, it's a waste of oil, but that is your decision at the end of the day.

As for the procedure going forward, as you are in possession of the procedure, you can follow it, and the necessary updates will be made to the hand books and manuals on Tritun in due course.

Thank you once more for your enquiry.

Best regards
*********
Triumph GB"

First of all . . . note the response re access to the document. I had no idea it was confidential, as I accessed if freely off the internet whilst following a discussion about this very issue - hey ho.

I didn't come entirely clean by suggesting I intended to carry out my own interim servicing. I was concerned that had I announced my intent to conduct all my own servicing, it might have resulted in a curveball response and advice simply to take my bike to the dealership for for this to be carried out professionally. As it turns out, I was merely told that to conduct interim changes is nothing more than a waste of oil - I'm inclined to agree!!

OK - so the response is a little non-committal but my interpretation is that the modified procedure is the correct one. Some dealers know about it and it would appear that some don't. It would seem the failure to update the owners manual and service manual on Tritun is nothing more than an oversight on behalf of Triumph, or at least, that is my assumption as they now suggest they will update both in due course . . . . rather late for the former as both the bike and engine are no longer in production. I assume the comment is placatory fluff but perhaps not and Triumph will send an amended procedure to all current owners via the V5 registration or similar for foreign owners.
This response confirms in my mind the only safe way to carry out an oil change on this bike is to do it myself. Given the turnover of technical staff at dealerships and the unique nature of this requirement, I genuinely suspect it won't happen at most dealers and all the moreso with the passage of time
Each to their own ;-)

 

This is an outrageous response from Triumph. This issue dates back to 2018. How long does it take to update electronic Handbooks and Service Manuals?
Access to Tritun comes at a cost and therefore should always be current. This is the sort of answer I would expect from a politician.