Neutral Selection

Discussion in 'Technical Help' started by chuk, Jul 15, 2017.

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  1. chuk

    chuk Senior Member
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    Jan 10, 2017
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    2011 speed triple had since February after 20 mls or so I've had problems selecting neutral,read a few articles about this one involving removing clutch plates and soaking in oil overnight,other filling gearbox up with oil and leaning bike over ti right side I done this as u don't have a workshop manual,the fill gearbox option seems to have worked a treat much easier to select neutral than before big difference,if problem resurfaces I will do the clutch plate oil soak but for now its a good fix.
     
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  2. chuk

    chuk Senior Member
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    #2 chuk, Jul 15, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2017
    . Yes filled engine up with about 10 litres of oil leaned bike over a bit left for 2 days,obviously i never ran it just drained oil back out and refilled it using original oil,so far seems to have worked i may in future get workshop manual and remove and soak clutch plates,YouTube video shows how to but its sped up,video shows 2 cases getting removed the large casing with dip stick and the smaller one do they both need removed ?,I'm sure somebody in here will know.
     
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  3. sprintdave

    sprintdave Nurse,he's out of bed again

    May 25, 2014
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    #3 sprintdave, Jul 17, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
    10 litres of oil? are you sure, that sounds a lot to me,my car only has about 5 litres in it. I dont know about my bike, I dont service it myself these days

    edit, just looked up 1050 speedie and they take 3.5 litres so yours is probably something around that
     
  4. Callumity

    Callumity Elite Member

    Feb 25, 2017
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    Like others I am amazed you could get that much oil in the thing!

    Apologies if I am teaching granny to suck eggs but how mechanically minded are you? Unlike a car your oil lubricates engine and gearbox and the clutch sits with the bottom 30% or so dipped into the oil. Wet clutches have multiple plates - a mix of friction plates and plain steel like a double cheeseburger!

    It is normal for there to be some drag in the mechanism i.e. a very slight grip when you pull the lever in. This is due to the oil sticking the plates together somewhat as they spin through the oil bath. It lessens as the engine warms and the oil thins to its working temperature. It explains the clunk when you engage 1st.

    I cannot think why 'soaking' the clutch would make a blind bit of difference except on brand new plates. If you have selection issues it is down to clutch adjustment (common) or mechanical issues like a bent selector or warped clutch (less common). Maybe you unknowingly bought a bike with 'issues'?

    You will damage an engine by running it overfull with blown seals and excessive crankcase pressures. Can I suggest you get that manual pronto? Adjust your clutch to spec and likewise the correct spec and volume of oil. Then if you still have selection problems describe the symptoms on here.
     
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  5. steve lovatt

    steve lovatt Something else

    May 12, 2014
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    Yeah - agree with the above!
     
  6. chuk

    chuk Senior Member
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    #6 chuk, Jul 17, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
    bike was never ran or even turned over when i filled the engine up (not quite that daft),ive read other posts elsewhere regarding this method,and the fix that requires removing the plates for a soaking in oil is also posted elsewhere why so negative,symptoms are as original post i.e when fully warmed up neutral is hard to engage some have stated different oil also sorts this i read another post on here where a tiger 1050 owner cant select neutral unless engine is not running,his bike is due a service so not seen another post from him yet but clutch is adjusted already 3mm of play at lever i was thinking about replacing the cable at one point but bikes only done 9k 2011 model.
     
  7. dilligaf

    dilligaf Guest

    Lot of people not reading properly
    Chuk says he drained the 10ltrs then filled up to the correct level
     
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  8. Callumity

    Callumity Elite Member

    Feb 25, 2017
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    Soaking plates is a bit of an internet myth and normally associated with aftermarket suppliers avoiding warranty claims from diy bodgers who inadvertently seize the clutch There IS a potential issue with kevlar racing plates which seem to be fussy about running in synthetic oils and which are more hassle than road use warrants unless (sticks neck out) you are a pub bore!
    The clutch basket gets plenty of splash lubrication once running but on its sidestand is part submerged. The excess gets thrown off once you start up. Assembling a new clutch should not require more than oiling the steel plates (not the friction plates) to prevent any corrosion/seizure before first start up.
     
  9. Callumity

    Callumity Elite Member

    Feb 25, 2017
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    He seemed vague on sump capacity!
     
  10. dilligaf

    dilligaf Guest

    Whatever the ins and outs of this method it appears to have worked for chuk :)
    Who knows?....the problem might come back :(but this seems to have been an easy fix for him :p
     
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  11. chuk

    chuk Senior Member
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    #11 chuk, Jul 17, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
    i know sump takes 3.2 ltr or 3.4 if filter change,i have the small handbook but not workshop manual,i have however started to put the bike more vertical instead of it leaning way over to the left if you get my meaning when on sidestand,i dare say the oil level will be slightly higher now on clutch side its possible that this has helped in itself,abbastand adapters ordered as I've got stand anyway from other bikes.
     
  12. Callumity

    Callumity Elite Member

    Feb 25, 2017
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    Well keep us posted if problems re-surface. Out of interest which oil have you used?
     
  13. chuk

    chuk Senior Member
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  14. Callumity

    Callumity Elite Member

    Feb 25, 2017
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    I must put my hands up because I was forgetting your clutch is on the right....
    My working suspicion is that bikes over-wintered on a sidestand will see their clutches dry out and with condensation forming on the plates you may well get clutch drag that will inhibit gear selection.
    Less effort to cant it well to the right and turn it over a few times on the starter with plugs lead detached!?
     
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  15. chuk

    chuk Senior Member
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    good point who knows how long it was on sidestand for before i bought it and i had left it like that also,I've got abbastand so going to buy the adapters then it will be sitting vertical when not in use that may well help can't do no harm as i only get out once a week on it.
     
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  16. Johnjo

    Johnjo Senior Member

    May 29, 2017
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    Hi guys.

    Prior to buying a bonneville recently I've spent the last 6 years on a tiger forum.

    This clutch issue was quite common on the 1050's. Especially back in 2008 when triumph released a batch of bikes where the clutches hadn't been oiled at all.

    Filling the engine with oil and lowering the bike over is a good quick fix. Zip tying the clutch lever down helped the process even more.

    Hope it works for you chuk.
     
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  17. chuk

    chuk Senior Member
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    that's something i never thought of i assume you mean pull lever in and cable tie in place?,so far I've done 3 trips since the filling and leaning bike over/drain refill oil and its 100% better,quite a large angle of lean when on sidestand so abbastand should be ideal.
     
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  18. Johnjo

    Johnjo Senior Member

    May 29, 2017
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    Yes, you've got it. Zip tie the lever while pulled back to the bars. Keeps the plates separated while they soak in the oil bath.
     
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