2017 R Hard Suspension

Discussion in 'Speed Triple' started by WesSmith, Feb 4, 2020.

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  1. tim8061

    tim8061 Member

    Dec 28, 2019
    26
    13
    Gloucester
    It doesn't sound bouncy so much as too hard, but ISTR an article where a magazine took a bunch of "normal" riders to a track and let them ride a bike with the suspension deliberately set way off. They asked them to say what they thought needed adjusting and none of them were remotely close. The conclusion was only the pro riders are that tuned in to work out what needs tweaking. But rattling your fillings means something is harsh. Easy enough to check sag and see if the spring is close, but then a progressive linkage like Triumph use compromises even the correct spring.
     
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  2. speeder

    speeder Noble Member

    Jan 3, 2019
    269
    313
    dorset
    Mine was rock hard too....bloody dangerous at times,the main problem was too much compression damping on the forks (particularly in cold weather )
    Just wound the adjusters off until ride was acceptable.
    The standard settings seem to be way too hard for our crap roads....they are more like track day settings.
     
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  3. SteveRS

    SteveRS Noble Member

    Jan 12, 2019
    556
    443
    British Columbia
    When the bike was new with fresh oil the road setting was fine for me, I’m 195 pounds with gear. As the the miles went on and the oil viscosity changed, I went to the sport setting. After approximately 7400 km’s I’ve firmed it up a little more. Our roads here are pretty good for the most part. My biggest worry was the stock spring rate. I have the rear shock preload backed off completely and it just gives me the sag needed without being too harsh of a ride. If I was any lighter the stock springs that come with our bikes would be too firm. I think that’s the problem for most people who find the ride too firm.
     
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  4. Bryan3R

    Bryan3R Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2018
    152
    93
    Southend, Essex, England
    #24 Bryan3R, Feb 18, 2020 at 6:54 PM
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2020 at 7:48 PM
    I’m 12 and half stone, took all preload off shock and set at comfort settings in manual for comp/rebound. Also set front preload to comfort setting, 7 turns of preload in from fully anti-clockwise.
    I had shock serviced and suspention set up last spring, they put 1mm preload on shock and left the other settings the same.
    Bike was a lot nicer to ride on roads, so if your about the same weight as me the spring is ok, just too much on the compression damping.
    The standard sag that Triumph says isn’t adjustable, is adjustable as no setting will work for everyone, and Ohlins put adjusters on the spring!
    From riding last year, I am going to try another full turn of front preload as the tie wrap is nearly at bottom of fork leg and possibly bottoming out under hard braking.
     
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  5. tim8061

    tim8061 Member

    Dec 28, 2019
    26
    13
    Gloucester
    You're completely wrong if you think adjusting preload does anything to "soften" the ride. All it does it change sag, and the way it handles bends by virtue of changing steering geometry.
     
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  6. SteveRS

    SteveRS Noble Member

    Jan 12, 2019
    556
    443
    British Columbia
    For the forks, where is compression at? That’s what you want to use stop it from going through to much of the stroke, not preload. Just get the sag right with preload, and it sounds like you did already, and then use compression to sort the forks. Once you run out of adjustment, it’s time for new fork oil. Actually a little earlier than fully screwed in would be best, as the fork compression, or rebound, shouldn’t be fully screwed in for the forks to work properly.
     
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  7. JULIAN WW

    JULIAN WW Well-Known Member

    Nov 27, 2019
    57
    68
    carlton in lindrick
    I've just picked up on this thread. You may get some useful input if you check out my post on suspension mods to my Thruxton R in Technical section. In a nutshell I found it necessary to change to lower rate springs front & back plus reduce the damping characteristics in the forks. I would suggest that changing settings to their minimum position does NOT reduce damping effect to zero or create a " dangerous" condition. Also the set up for a race track will be incompatible with ordinary road conditions ( and most likely riding style) unless you live some country where they still maintain roads to a high standard.
     
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  8. SteveRS

    SteveRS Noble Member

    Jan 12, 2019
    556
    443
    British Columbia
    #28 SteveRS, Feb 19, 2020 at 9:25 AM
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020 at 5:14 PM
    Thanks I’ll have a look. Backing off the rebound all the way out will definitely make for an uncontrolled rebound, forks or rear shock, when the suspension has been compressed. Also, with compression backed all the way out you’ll have little assistance from the oil to help the suspension from blowing through its travel, as you’ll be relying mostly on the spring. I’ll give you an example: On my bike, as the fork and shock oils broke down over several months, I found the need to increase the damping. At high speeds going into corners I needed more support from my suspension in order to have the control needed for this type or ridding. For me, backing the damping all the way out would “definitely” make riding like that dangerous. With no compression my forks would come very close to bottoming out while trail braking into a corner. With no rebound control my suspension would not allow my tires to stick to the road while leaned over in the corner, if the road surface is uneven. Any info regarding suspension set up that I have mentioned here has come from working with my local suspension expert. We all have different expectations and demands from our suspensions, so what suits the needs and is safe one rider, may be unacceptable and unsafe for another.
     
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  9. Bryan3R

    Bryan3R Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2018
    152
    93
    Southend, Essex, England
    #29 Bryan3R, Feb 19, 2020 at 7:16 PM
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020 at 8:02 PM
    Correct, and that wasn’t the reason I changed the preload.
    I didn’t go into it in my post, but the bike had zero static sag with the standard rear preload setting that Triumph use, and for my weight, rider sag was way under what it should be. This would have me in the position that if the shock topped out over a big enough dip, the rear wheel would be lifted off the ground rather than keeping in in contact with the ground.
     
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  10. Bryan3R

    Bryan3R Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2018
    152
    93
    Southend, Essex, England
    By doing that your not completely controlling how much the spring compressed under heavy breaking, your just slowing the rate that it gets to bottoming out.
     
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  11. SteveRS

    SteveRS Noble Member

    Jan 12, 2019
    556
    443
    British Columbia
    Assuming the spring rates are correct for rider weight, compression and rebound are your only other options for controlling the suspension. What other means do I have?
     
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  12. tim8061

    tim8061 Member

    Dec 28, 2019
    26
    13
    Gloucester
    Volume and weight of oil will change how the suspension reacts.
     
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  13. SteveRS

    SteveRS Noble Member

    Jan 12, 2019
    556
    443
    British Columbia
    Assuming the spring rates are correct for rider weight, compression and rebound are your only other options for controlling the suspension. What other means do I have?
    Agreed. But only if the compression and rebound won’t do it’s job with the current weight of oil.
     
  14. Bryan3R

    Bryan3R Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2018
    152
    93
    Southend, Essex, England
    #34 Bryan3R, Feb 19, 2020 at 8:59 PM
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2020 at 9:06 PM
    Luckily my bike needed a new fork seal, so has fresh oil in there, so I didn’t have it serviced when the shock was done, but going to get them done by local Ohlins centre this year.
    Here’s my set up card

    0FB0884A-2D5D-497B-8690-2A78389F812B.jpeg

    compared to standard and comfort settings

    06BEAF65-B14C-43D7-87A6-74A69B79A406.jpeg

    So a click more of compression damping over standard.
     
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  15. SteveRS

    SteveRS Noble Member

    Jan 12, 2019
    556
    443
    British Columbia
    Nice!
     
  16. Bryan3R

    Bryan3R Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2018
    152
    93
    Southend, Essex, England
    What do you weigh Steve, and where you at with setting on the RS?
    I think they kept the same spring rate on them, 100 on my shock spring.
     
  17. Bryan3R

    Bryan3R Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2018
    152
    93
    Southend, Essex, England
    Yes, but the Ohlins stuff on R/RS only has 5w oil as better damping control than the standard suspention, std suspention is 10w.
     
  18. SteveRS

    SteveRS Noble Member

    Jan 12, 2019
    556
    443
    British Columbia
    12.5 stone. Front preload is stock. Front comp is 9, reb is 10. Rear preload all the way out, comp is 18 and reb is 9. Don’t remember what the stock spring rate is for the shock.

    E4BF412C-6A47-432C-8804-5CEB9D9E3EBD.png
     
  19. SteveRS

    SteveRS Noble Member

    Jan 12, 2019
    556
    443
    British Columbia
    There is no standard from one manufacturer to another when it comes to oil weight viscosity.
     
  20. Bryan3R

    Bryan3R Well-Known Member

    Jun 22, 2018
    152
    93
    Southend, Essex, England
    But there is for Ohlins Steve.

    So your about the same weight as me but got more compression damping buy a fair few clicks.
     
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