Uk Gov 'thinking About' Anti-tampering Regs!

Discussion in 'Triumph General Discussion' started by beerkat, Oct 12, 2021 at 3:56 PM.

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  1. Jadorff

    Jadorff Noble Member

    Apr 14, 2019
    760
    443
    Adelaide Australia
    in aus u can't have straight through pipes, and there is a noise limit on exhaust sound just read the other day we have a poliey who wants to ban petrol lawn mowers and petrol blowers
     
  2. Neal H

    Neal H Member

    Mar 7, 2021
    68
    18
    England
    I don’t believe it….

    Don’t even get me started on petrol powered lawn mowers….
     
  3. beerkat

    beerkat Senior Member

    Aug 14, 2019
    543
    243
    Cheshire UK
    Right, I said I would keep you posted, so here it comes.

    I will try to keep this brief and relevant but if you are at all interested in modifying or changing your bike in any way then read all of it.

    The Department for Transport (DfT) has issued a document called 'Future of transport regulatory review consultation: Modernising vehicle standards'.
    The DfT says this is their THIRD opportunity to gather information on regulation. The other two took place during 2019 and 2020, when people had other things on their minds.
    In it they state they are '..seeking powers to amend, repeal or replace relevant sections of EU law'. Are they referring to German-style type approval? Possibly. Then they say '..we propose to create powers..to amend legislation on the type-approval of vehicles'. Ah, so they are.

    On page 11 (of 18) they deal with 'Tackling tampering' and open with 'We will create new offences for tampering with a system, part or component of a vehicle intended to be used on the road'. They follow that with '..and for advertising tampering services or products'.

    This is all done under the umbrella of '..regulating safety, security and environmental performance'. Which on the face of it sounds very commendable and I can see people nodding in agreement. But if it happens it MAY (and probably will) completely alter the world of motorcycling that we know and love.

    So there you have it. Changes are coming. Or at least the DfT want changes, so they can control what we do with our bikes. You will have your own opinion on this and should look at the whole document. As I said before, this is about a hell of a lot more than exhausts. It could potentially cover everything. Yes, this sounds bonkers to us because we know that OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) parts are sometimes inferior to the after-market parts we can replace them with. For example we can actually improve safety. But the DfT DON'T KNOW this unless someone explains it to them. Remember, we are a tiny minority and the vast majority of people have no concept of motorcycle ownership and use.

    So, instead of saying 'I hate loud exhausts' or 'I don't see why anyone would want to change a standard bike' (or get distracted by petrol powered lawnmowers FFS), think about the next time you want to upgrade the crap shocks that Triumph fit to some bikes, or fit different mirrors, or replace that rusty end can, or switch camshafts to give a bit more oomph (yes, I did that). Or a 100 other things. You might not be legally allowed to unless the manufacturer of those parts has paid to have each part tested on each model, in other words 'type-approval' (that's what it means).

    Now you need to decide whether you care enough to actually DO SOMETHING. If you do, then give the document a glance (it really isn't that long or complicated) and respond to the bit at the end where they ask your opinion. Alternatively (as I may have mentioned before ;)) support MAG and they will do it on your behalf.

    Now I'm going to put the kettle on :cool:
     
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  4. toony73

    toony73 New Member

    Thursday
    1
    3
    coventry england
    really cant see this coming into force.
    The police make to much revenue from fixed penalty notices.
    All the tax the government will lose.
    plus its not enforceable.
    if its bikes its cars to .......
    cutting nose off to spite face comes tome mind
     
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  5. Bikerman

    Bikerman Crème de la Crème
    Subscriber

    Oct 29, 2014
    6,442
    1,000
    Lincolnshire
  6. beerkat

    beerkat Senior Member

    Aug 14, 2019
    543
    243
    Cheshire UK
    Not quite sure what you mean by 'all the tax the government will lose'. It's the government who are proposing these changes. I know this government is dim but they must feel advantages outweigh any disadvantages as far as they're concerned.
    I would think it's totally enforceable. A bike has to stay exactly as it left the showroom. Your annual MOT test will be one way of checking as will every time you put it in for a service. Would you go to the trouble of switching everything back to standard? Doubt it. Will after-market manufacturers go to the trouble or cost of getting type-approval? If they don't the market will dwindle.
    Yes, it applies to cars but how many changes have you made to your car? In recent years I don't think I have ever altered my car in the same way I have changed every bike I've owned.
     
  7. toony73

    toony73 New Member

    Thursday
    1
    3
    coventry england
    There are more modified cars out there than bikes trust me,
    we all know to swap parts for mot time pop the old cat exhuast back on if you have a jobsworth tester.
    the government dont know an important decision if it beats them up ;)
     
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  8. Wessa

    Wessa Cruising

    Apr 27, 2016
    9,582
    1,000
    North West England
    I have downloaded and read the report. From what I have read the focus is on ‘tampering products’ and the advertising and sale of these products. It covers all vehicles or non-road mobile machinery (NRMM), like construction equipment.
    From what I can glean the focus is on emissions and it looks like they are trying to close the loophole the diesel scandal created, where false claims were made by many car manufacturers. In addition specific powers to cover automated vehicles which current legislation does not cover.
    Ok there are a lot more clever people out there than me, but I cannot see that the current paper opens the door for the removal of the ability to fit after market products unless they quote “bypass, defeat, reduce the effectiveness of or render inoperative a system, part or component (the product may be a physical part or component, hardware and/or software)”
    So changing out indicators or replacing an exhaust that meet noise levels etc does not seem to be to be included.
    So it is good that MAG are monitoring the progress of the consultation and hopefully in the final analysis it will not have the impact that is feared it will have. :);)
     
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  9. beerkat

    beerkat Senior Member

    Aug 14, 2019
    543
    243
    Cheshire UK
    My knowledge of the world of modified cars is rather limited so I will take your word for it. So are you suggesting there will be an outcry from these hordes of car owners against type-approval, so we can sit back and rely on them to do the job for us? Maybe you're right. That's if they know about it. Governments have a way of sneaking this type of proposal into law by doing the bare minimum when it comes to informing the public. Look at it logically, if the vast majority of car owners don't give a :poop: because they have no intention of modifying their vehicles, and the DfT can convince them it's all in a good cause, then they're going to ignore the issue and those that enjoy tinkering (or 'tampering') with their cars will be hugely outnumbered. Game over.

    My point is that if we don't speak out, or preferably shout out loud, then this could well happen and it's no good waiting for modified-car enthusiasts or anyone else to get vocal. If we don't say something then the government isn't going to know that we care. So say something.

    And as far as 'popping the old cat exhaust back on' at MOT time, are you having a laugh? It would take several days for me to return my bike to standard, in fact I couldn't. My local MOT man ignores slightly dodgy number plates (because he can claim that wasn't the one on the bike when he tested it) and as there is no requirement to actually measure exhaust noise, he's happy to use 'his judgement'. But present him with a bike with a dozen or more changes and he'd be hard pressed to turn a blind eye.
     
  10. beerkat

    beerkat Senior Member

    Aug 14, 2019
    543
    243
    Cheshire UK
    Hope you're right Wessa. Maybe I'm wrong about this issue and I agree that some of what's in the report can be interpreted in different ways, but isn't that always the way..and the intention? We shall see.
     
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  11. Wessa

    Wessa Cruising

    Apr 27, 2016
    9,582
    1,000
    North West England
    Agreed. I also completed the survey and the questions provide a better insight to the proposals.. it is well worth the effort to go through :)
     
  12. Wessa

    Wessa Cruising

    Apr 27, 2016
    9,582
    1,000
    North West England
    Agreed. I also completed the survey and the questions provide a better insight to the proposals.. it is well worth the effort to go through :)
     
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