Uk Gov 'thinking About' Anti-tampering Regs!

Discussion in 'Triumph General Discussion' started by beerkat, Oct 12, 2021.

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  1. beerkat

    beerkat Senior Member

    Aug 14, 2019
    633
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    Cheshire UK
    MAG have just revealed that during a recent meeting their political dept had with government officials, it came to light that the government are looking at the possibility of introducing anti-tampering laws, along similar lines to some other European countries. No details yet or any reason given. But we all know how some parts of Europe are very restrictive when it comes to modifying or customising motorbikes, for example Germany. I can't think what might have brought this on except it could have something to do with complaints about noisy exhausts, but that's just me speculating. If that is the reason then it would be easier for the government to bring in a blanket ban on ALL mods, rather than mess about being specific and then trying to deal with loopholes further down the line.

    All you non-MAG members out there will be pleased to know that MAG are taking up the issue and investigating on your behalf. No, no, you don't have to thank me for handing over my (paltry) £27 membership fee, so it can be used to fund the fight against idiotic bureaucrats and their daft rules.
    However, should this type of regulation be introduced because MAG couldn't muster the support needed to prevent it, then I hope non-MAG members don't complain when after-market exhausts, shocks and whatever else can't be fitted to their bikes. If we don't stand up for ourselves no-one is going to do it for us!
     
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  2. andyc1

    andyc1 Lunarville 7, Airlock 3

    Feb 4, 2017
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    Its only a matter of time I reckon, everyone likes a nice exhaust note but there's so many dick heads about that will ultimately ruin it for everybody.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  3. stollydriver

    stollydriver Elite Member

    Apr 25, 2015
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    I read that after market lighting ( indicators, tail and headlight) will be targeted.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  4. Dawsy

    Dawsy Cumbrian half-wit
    Subscriber

    Aug 24, 2018
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    The other week at Devils Bridge a tool arrived on a V4 Tuono and I have never heard a bike make so much noise. Even ticking over it was deafening. Bet his neighbours love him. :mad:
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  5. Patchinko

    Patchinko Senior Member

    Feb 1, 2018
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    S.W. Hants
    The V4 Aprilla sounds absolutely amazing with free breathing pipes. A heavenly harmony :heart_eyes:
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Dawsy

    Dawsy Cumbrian half-wit
    Subscriber

    Aug 24, 2018
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    Don't get me wrong I love a nice sounding bike and Ron Arrows on my Speedy but that was ridiculous
     
  7. Pegscraper

    Pegscraper Elite Member

    Jun 12, 2020
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    Anti tampering legislation was raised some years back but was rejected by the UK. It could potentially be finding a second wind with the way H&S is going plus the climate change/anti pollution hysteria gathering pace. Throw in the loud exhaust problem and it could well be forced through. It all depends on how far the "anti-tampering" goes. Altering OEM lighting could be regarded as a safety issue but adding auxiliary lights could be acceptable? Agreed, a blanket ban on doing/adding anything to the OEM spec would be a worse case scenario and would probably the easiest and preferred option. Loud exhausts are already illegal so ease of policing would be a big consideration on any measures brought in.
     
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  8. Chainbiter

    Chainbiter Well-Known Member

    Aug 6, 2021
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    North Yorkshire
    Hmm, it appears that no one has pointed out to the bean counting members of pratliment that the aftermarket parts industry for motorcycles is enormous.

    There's thousands upon thousands of different parts available with 20% vat being paid on each single item. Thousands of people are employed in the manufacture, retail and fitting of these items and all those people pay income tax and national insurance.

    If the arse falls out of that industry due to excessive legislation then a massive chunk of revenue goes with.

    Not to mention the job losses and numerous people who'll end up claiming benefits. People who earn money spend said money on feeding their families and paying their bills and mortgages.

    If they won't be earning, they won't be spending.

    Gormless stupid politicians and their gormless stupid knee jerk solutions.
     
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  9. Pegscraper

    Pegscraper Elite Member

    Jun 12, 2020
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    Yorkshire
    Do you really think the decision makers give a toss about that? Depending on where you look for figures there are around 1.2m registered motorcyles in the UK verses over 31m cars and then there's commercial vehicles so we're very much a minority road user, then there's the accident statistics in which we don't fare too well. The "enormous" after market parts trade is a drop in the ocean comparatively. Just look at the revenue the Govt rakes in from fags, booze and fuel yet we're all being encouraged to quit smoking (I don't anyway), cut down on alcohol intake and walk/cycle more.
     
  10. Chainbiter

    Chainbiter Well-Known Member

    Aug 6, 2021
    103
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    North Yorkshire
    Probably not, but they should.
     
  11. beerkat

    beerkat Senior Member

    Aug 14, 2019
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    Cheshire UK
    As Bikerman has rightly pointed out, the best way to let the government know how you feel about this issue is to cough up the measly £27 and join MAG and let them do the work on our behalf. Alternatively, you could write to the appropriate government department (if you can find out who to address it to), lobby your MP (who won't know what you're on about..or care) and stand outside the Houses of Parliament with a placard (yeah, right).

    If this happens it could affect just about all of us (yes, even you). This is about more than just noisy exhausts. If you wait until the government has a firm plan then it's already well on the way to being done'n'dusted. They don't usually like to backtrack. There aren't enough motorcyclists out there to make even this pathetic government do a U-turn on this one. The key is to get involved as early in the planning stage as possible, which is exactly what MAG does.

    So instead of thinking 'it's got nothing to do with me', 'we won't be able to make a difference' or (and I love this one!) 'I don't do politics', get involved or join MAG (preferably both).
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. Neal H

    Neal H Active Member

    Mar 7, 2021
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    England
    I would welcome something that banned noisy exhausts. I’m a biker and a life-long petrol head and frankly I’m often embarrassed by some of the anti-social noise pollution emitted by many bikes (and some cars).

    I live on the edge of a town which has a rather nice twisty A road leading out of it, popular with bikes and cars - heck, I even enjoy a regular blat along it myself. But, sometimes in the summer when you’re sat in the garden you can hear bikes screaming there engines along it for a good five minutes! Frankly they’re fecking stupidly loud.

    I don’t get why anyone wants their bike to be louder than it is factory standard - you’re wearing ear plugs and a crash helmet FFS - you can’t really hear much anyway, and if you can, then it just shows how stupidly loud your bike actually is. All you’re doing is pissing off the locals and making draconian legislation more likely. But if that’s what it takes, so be it.

    If an outright ban on modifying bikes and cars came into effect, I personally wouldn’t care less. I feel zero need to make my Speed Triple go even faster and I certainly don’t need to make it noisier.

    It must be my age…..
     
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  13. Wessa

    Wessa Cruising

    Apr 27, 2016
    10,544
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    Unless something has been published providing details on what is proposed it seems a little previous to get too worked up about this story.
    There is plenty of existing laws for loud exhaust and other illegal bike modifications, so unless they are planning to make all modifications illegal, which imo would be somewhat extreme. I’m not sure what impact the changes might have.
    It is good that MAG are keeping up with the proposals and once they have something more concrete we can evaluate.
     
  14. beerkat

    beerkat Senior Member

    Aug 14, 2019
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    I'll keep you posted.
     
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  15. Wessa

    Wessa Cruising

    Apr 27, 2016
    10,544
    1,000
    North West England
    That would be really helpful @beerkat
     
  16. Patchinko

    Patchinko Senior Member

    Feb 1, 2018
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    S.W. Hants
    20211013_212327.png
     
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  17. Pegscraper

    Pegscraper Elite Member

    Jun 12, 2020
    2,153
    800
    Yorkshire
    While I agree on the loud exhaust problem, an outright ban similar to what was proposed last time would not mean only performance parts but cosmetic and customising parts like aftermarket screens, footrests, bar risers etc etc. It could also mean tamper proof engines with locked down electronics making DIY servicing very difficult if not impossible.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  18. Jadorff

    Jadorff Noble Member

    Apr 14, 2019
    826
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    Adelaide Australia
    in aus u can't have straight through pipes, and there is a noise limit on exhaust sound just read the other day we have a poliey who wants to ban petrol lawn mowers and petrol blowers
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. Neal H

    Neal H Active Member

    Mar 7, 2021
    174
    43
    England
    I don’t believe it….

    Don’t even get me started on petrol powered lawn mowers….
     
  20. beerkat

    beerkat Senior Member

    Aug 14, 2019
    633
    243
    Cheshire UK
    Right, I said I would keep you posted, so here it comes.

    I will try to keep this brief and relevant but if you are at all interested in modifying or changing your bike in any way then read all of it.

    The Department for Transport (DfT) has issued a document called 'Future of transport regulatory review consultation: Modernising vehicle standards'.
    The DfT says this is their THIRD opportunity to gather information on regulation. The other two took place during 2019 and 2020, when people had other things on their minds.
    In it they state they are '..seeking powers to amend, repeal or replace relevant sections of EU law'. Are they referring to German-style type approval? Possibly. Then they say '..we propose to create powers..to amend legislation on the type-approval of vehicles'. Ah, so they are.

    On page 11 (of 18) they deal with 'Tackling tampering' and open with 'We will create new offences for tampering with a system, part or component of a vehicle intended to be used on the road'. They follow that with '..and for advertising tampering services or products'.

    This is all done under the umbrella of '..regulating safety, security and environmental performance'. Which on the face of it sounds very commendable and I can see people nodding in agreement. But if it happens it MAY (and probably will) completely alter the world of motorcycling that we know and love.

    So there you have it. Changes are coming. Or at least the DfT want changes, so they can control what we do with our bikes. You will have your own opinion on this and should look at the whole document. As I said before, this is about a hell of a lot more than exhausts. It could potentially cover everything. Yes, this sounds bonkers to us because we know that OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) parts are sometimes inferior to the after-market parts we can replace them with. For example we can actually improve safety. But the DfT DON'T KNOW this unless someone explains it to them. Remember, we are a tiny minority and the vast majority of people have no concept of motorcycle ownership and use.

    So, instead of saying 'I hate loud exhausts' or 'I don't see why anyone would want to change a standard bike' (or get distracted by petrol powered lawnmowers FFS), think about the next time you want to upgrade the crap shocks that Triumph fit to some bikes, or fit different mirrors, or replace that rusty end can, or switch camshafts to give a bit more oomph (yes, I did that). Or a 100 other things. You might not be legally allowed to unless the manufacturer of those parts has paid to have each part tested on each model, in other words 'type-approval' (that's what it means).

    Now you need to decide whether you care enough to actually DO SOMETHING. If you do, then give the document a glance (it really isn't that long or complicated) and respond to the bit at the end where they ask your opinion. Alternatively (as I may have mentioned before ;)) support MAG and they will do it on your behalf.

    Now I'm going to put the kettle on :cool:
     
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