Thruxton R Barrel Fault Hairline Crack Or Porosity Leaking Coolant

Discussion in 'Technical Help' started by timboo, Aug 6, 2022.

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  1. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
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    #1 timboo, Aug 6, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2022
    Hi all prior to me speaking to the main dealer where I purchased my bike from I’d just like to get some advice on here.
    I rode my bike a week ago its a 2017 with little over 3k miles on the clock.
    It is stored in my dry garage. After returning from my holiday a week later I noticed a liquid trail down the engine. Upon further inspection the fluid has a green tint to it and it started as shown in the image within the yellow circle. Paint has begun to come away from the location. I can only assume there is a hairline crack. its impossible to get up close to verify due to its location.
    Anyone ever come across this before?

    Although I have 1 yrs warranty on it is this likely to turn into a major job? Seems an odd place to go wrong although it clearly gets very hot


    0DB86EA9-5C2F-4B09-91CF-E766436609CA.jpeg
     
  2. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
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    Cambridgeshire
    I have looked again since cleaning it up and there is pooling at that location again so seems pretty conclusive
     
  3. Baza

    Baza Elite Member

    Jul 25, 2020
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    Sounds like coolant then? A poor barrel casting.
     
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  4. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
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    #4 timboo, Aug 7, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2022
    Cheers once verified as being so I’d like to understand how common a issue it is given this engine is used across models. Dont fancy this occurring outside of warranty
     
  5. Iceman

    Iceman Crème de la Crème

    Apr 19, 2020
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    Hi timboo, I have not heard of any failures of barrels on 1200 Bonneville engines leading to coolant loss, nor any modern Triumph engine come to that, other faults yes but not the one like yours. Like Baza says it sounds as though it's a casting fault. It is a fairly straightforward job, head and barrels off and replace barrels and build top end back up, I guess the part will have to go off to Triumph first for inspection and the dealer given the ok to carry out the work, given it is an expensive job, if that is the case insist your dealer give you a loan bike as it is likely to take some weeks. At least you did not buy it private and it is under warranty, I would estimate a price of around the 2.5k for parts and labour. Let the forum know how it progresses.
     
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  6. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
    271
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    Many thanks for your detailed response.
    Gives me a good idea of what to expect. I think the crux will be how quick they are to diagnose and move forwards.
    Have to say I am rather gutted as I love my bike its my pride and joy.
     
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  7. andyc1

    andyc1 Lunarville 7, Airlock 3

    Feb 4, 2017
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    And another break-in period will be required no doubt.
     
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  8. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
    271
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    Yep annoying timing was due to get my springs uprated on the rear in the next few weeks
     
  9. Baza

    Baza Elite Member

    Jul 25, 2020
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    I know the right way to correct this fault is to replace the defective part but it may also be feasible to rectify the problem insitu.

    I don't know what material the barrels are made from but would suspect a ferrous material rather than ally with liners.

    What appears to be the problem is a failure of the coolant jacket to the engine. The walls of which are not subject to very high pressures but do endure large temperature cycles.

    Once the coolant has been drained it should be possible to identify the location and extent of the failure by the use of penetrant dye as used in NDT examinations. Once the nature and magnitude of the failure is known it may be possible to effect a local repair by grinding out and TIG welding the crack.

    My thoughts are based upon a repair I carried out on the oil cooler of my Ducati after I had errantly ripped the fixing bracket off and breached the lowest gallery of the cooler. Having discovered the cost of a new part and sought the advice of many so called radiator and oil cooler specialists, even going the Bicester Heritage where they manufacture one off coolers for Warbirds I decided to have a go myself. The problem was that the cooler is made of aluminium and wall thicknesses are not great. The bracket was spot welded to the the lowest gallery,

    My repair was effected by thoroughly cleaning with brake cleaner and drying the damaged area, drilling a hole through the "L" bracket and both walls of the lowest oil gallery, liberally applying good old Araldite to the bracket and external faces of the oil gallery and then blind riveting the bracket on using a stainless steel pop rivet which not only fixed the bracket on but sealed the oil gallery by locally pinching the walls together.

    As the engine is air/oil cooled, no plumbing on the machine :joy:, my concerns were that I had irreparably reduced the effectiveness of the oil cooler, such that oil temps would be abnormally high but no such evidence has been forthcoming and the author of this thread has actually seen the machine in use.
     
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  10. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
    271
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    #10 timboo, Aug 8, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2022
    Thanks for the alternate solution. Could be a good backup plan. Hoping this falls under warranty though and cant see why it wont. Makes sense that it isnt under high pressure with the way the fluid has leaked. Not sure I’d want to ride it anywhere though.
    How long did it take you to complete your fix please?

    Ta
     
  11. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
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    #11 timboo, Aug 8, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2022
    Todays update.

    Spoke with the main dealer this morning where I purchased my bike (2.5hrs away) The service department initially advised that their warranty was 3 months, which I stated was a year as per their own web site.
    Not the best start to the journey of trying to get my bike fixed.
    I was then transferred to the service manager who said he didnt know how to get the bike to them. He suggested I claim on my recovery. Unfortunately my recovery didn’t cover from home to a dealer of my beaconing!
    I then asked if their warranty was valid with themselves only or transferable to another triumph main dealer, ie one closer to home. The service manager couldn’t provide a firm response and said he would get back to me.

    It’s looking like I may have to pay to get my bike recovered just a case of how far to keep costs down.
     
  12. Helmut Visor

    Helmut Visor Only dead fish go with the flow
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    If they won't recover an unrideable bike under warranty then tell them you're happy to take it to a dealer of your choice and they will bill the original dealer direct for any work done, that should get them moving ;)
     
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  13. Iceman

    Iceman Crème de la Crème

    Apr 19, 2020
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    Hi timboo, if your machine was purchased as a used Triumph approved machine, then it comes with a 12 month warranty and as such should be covered at any Triumph dealer, however I would insist that the dealer you bought it from collects the machine and carry out the inspection and any repairs, if their response is unsatisfactory then enter into a formal complaint via the Triumph UK website, they are quick to respond and Triumph will make contact with the dealer and e mail you on progress, it is not your responsibility to go and chase up recovery to the dealer, nor stand the cost. The 1200 barrels are alloy, therefore you can use TIG or MIG welding, TIG welding is ideal for repairing broken fins on cylinder heads, holes and cracks in crankcases and can be used to build up castings with pieces missing. The weld can be machined, drilled, tapped and polished. However MIG welding is generally used on larger areas such as welding heavy gauge aluminium plate and not suitable for alloy cylinders, using the TIG welder less heat is produced during the welding process, reducing the risk of distorting. There are a number of issues to consider when deciding to repair such a task as yours, and unless you are proficient with TIG welding then I would respectfully suggest do not attempt the repair, you will need to drain the coolant, then prep the area first by grinding the area, or other suitable method to remove the coating, then thoroughly de grease the area, once welded you will need to clean the weld up, then repaint the area, however any repair will reduce the machines value, and if you sell your machine at any point you have to be truthful in the description and any disclosure (if you are asked about any history of repairs or faults, past or present), the last thing you want is a CC claim for reimbursement. The good news is your machine appears to be Triumph approved and as mentioned if no satisfaction from your dealer then go straight to Triumph direct, good luck and keep the forum updated. Ride safe all from an ageing Rocker.
     
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  14. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
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    #14 timboo, Aug 8, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2022
    Thanks for all the info. I am going to to be on the case of the dealer daily for a progress update.
    Thus far I am less than impressed with their knowledge and professionalism including their empathy although the next few days will define the way this goes.
    l wont be welding it thats for sure, for 2 reasons. 1. It’s my baby and a long term investment, which is immaculate OCD would kick in knowing it has been repaired would drive me wild. 2. I wouldn’t know the first thing about welding although I really appreciate your input, which is very informative.
     
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  15. Baza

    Baza Elite Member

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    Many thanks Iceman. A superb definitive assessment of the problem at hand. Timboo called me yesterday and he appears to be taking this in his stride. I would be bloody fuming. :mad:
     
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  16. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
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    I hinted at that on the phone yesterday with them. Every conversation I have I am going to ask them to followup in writing alternatively I will summarise the convo in an email and ask them to reply.
     
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  17. Helmut Visor

    Helmut Visor Only dead fish go with the flow
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    Definitely worth doing that. Email has a quicker turnaround, is easier and just as admissible ;)
     
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  18. timboo

    timboo Senior Member

    Oct 17, 2021
    271
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    Todays progress

    They are sticking to 3 months warranty on used. Not much use when you purchase a bike over winter dont use it until the following year and therefore will very unlikely find fault within the warranty period.

    With that in mind it’s a bit of a learning curve me and for others considering purchasing a used bike over winter to weigh up their options and maybe hold off until spring. My issue could be extremely rare but it could turn out to be very very expensive.

    I re iterated that the cause of fault is pretty conclusive.
    They are going to speak with others higher up in the food chain re a gesture of good will. Fingers crossed.
     
  19. learningtofly

    learningtofly He’s not the Messiah, he’s a very naughty boy!
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    Are you happy to name the dealer that sold the bike to you? You'll know this, of course, but...

    "An Approved Used Triumph motorcycle is our assurance that all bikes have met our meticulous standards before they reach the showroom. To the customer it is a new bike – so it should feel like one.

    Every approved Triumph pre-owned motorcycle includes the following:

    -1 Year unlimited mileage warranty*
    -1 Year Roadside Assistance**
    - Certified Vehicle Quality check
    - Full Service History
    - 1 Year MOT
    - Vehicle History and Mileage Check
    - Finance available"
     
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  20. Baza

    Baza Elite Member

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    Very interesting. What was the caveat on the first item?
     
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