2022 Speed Triple Oil Change Problem-no Oil Pressure

Discussion in 'Triumph General Discussion' started by pilot3, Jun 26, 2021.

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  1. pilot3

    pilot3 New Member

    May 28, 2021
    24
    3
    Spokane, WA
    #1 pilot3, Jun 26, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2021
    Morning all,

    I just had an oil change experience with my 2022 Speed Triple 1200 RS and the intel needs to be posted. This is very much a similar issue to the 2018 Speed Triple vacuum issue that has been posted as well.

    I will call out a few items to be clear:

    A) I have no major complaints about my dealer. They do understand that this was a problem for me and they were receptive and made calls to Triumph to try and sort it. I do believe that there were some thoughts that I was an idiot and couldn’t manage my own oil change or that perhaps I was doing something wrong. The dealer also told me that Triumph was telling them this problem did not exist and that Triumph has no special procedure for changing oil. I called BS on this and ultimately sent the document I sourced from another post to them. After looking at the bike under warranty, the dealer realized I was correct.

    I also realize and appreciate the dealer’s position. The weather has turned nice here and they are swamped with work. They are a small dealership, I am somewhat surprised (and fortunate) that there is a full service Triumph dealer where I live (Spokane, WA) and I am sure they don’t see the volume of bikes that a larger city would. Being super busy they had to work me in to their schedule knowing that I was leaving on a 10-day trip very soon. As I said in the first sentence, I have no major complaints. My minor complaint was that I had to agree to a $50 pickup fee for them to come pick up my bike. The Service Manager told me they would try to reclaim it in the warranty claim but ultimately I was responsible. This kinda burns after dropping almost $20k US on a new bike which decides to not be rideable after 500 miles. Oh and I live 1.4 miles from the dealer.

    B) Second, this is not meant to create an oil or parts debate here. The few times I had run the bike ever so briefly I was not concerned that there would be damage and fortunately the tech at the dealer, who called me directly to discuss what he did/found, was just as concerned and did his best to mitigate causing any damage. I will detail some product choices I made which were specifically to avoid any concern from Triumph regarding my warranty.

    C) After sourcing what I have found to be credible information regarding Triumph in the UK, I believe that Triumph USA and UK just aren’t very good about sharing information. The bulletin I found addressing the issue in the UK on the 2018-20 Speedys was completely foreign (no pun intended) to Triumph USA.

    D) I am going into a lot of minutiae in the details not because it makes a good story, but I want everyone to know exactly what I did to try to resolve this, including bike positioning, products, etc, in case a dealer tells you that you are not doing something correctly. Otherwise I realize I could make this a three sentence post.

    E) My timeline for bike maintenance was that I needed to get the mileage on, so I could do the oil change and strip the plastics off the bike and I have a trip on July 6th that I was prepping for.

    I had made arrangements to ship all my plastics to a business in Southern California who does clear bra kits for bikes, www.thetankslapper.biz. I have used them for years, his kits are exceptional, and had saved my fairings and tank from damage over the years. That will be another post.

    Due to the bike being stripped, I chose to do my own first service at home as it fit with my needs, there was no reason to pay the dealer to do it, and then my bike would be at home since I would not be able to ride it post op for a few weeks. I was also pulling the wheels and tires to install my TPMS sensors, all things I could do as I was rehabbing my knee.

    F) I will throw in some part numbers for items I am starting to find are applicable to this bike for certain things. I have no connection to these businesses, but the are things I use and have found that work on this bike even though they are not listed on some manufacturers websites yet.

    G) I confirmed the oil change procedure I would normally use is the same as published in the 2022 Speedy Owner’s Manual and also is the same procedure in the Speedy 1200 Service manual. Not too hard: drain oil, refit plug, drain filter, refit filter, fill oil. Yeah, we all get it, super simple.


    Story time:

    I took delivery of my 2022 Speedy in mid-May 2021. Started to get the break in mileage done knowing I was going to have a short break due to knee surgery. I ride a few days in succession and the final day, the odometer reaches 546 miles and it is about 90 degrees when I arrive home. I pull the bike into the garage and park it. I was planning on just chilling out but I realized I had my pending knee surgery so I decided to dump the oil while it was hot since I wouldn’t be riding for a couple of weeks.

    So the bike goes onto my lift and is stood vertically in the nose clamp and with a Pit-Bull rear stand. The LEFT side of the rear hub uses the same as the large hub Ducatis so the Pit-Bull P/N# F0099-200. The right side pin was just released from Pit-Bull and is P/N# F0099-016. I ultiamtely needed the bike lifted by the left side of the hub so I could remove the rear wheel for the TPMS install.

    So the oil is draining and I decide the tackle the oil filter. If you have paid attention to it, just below the filter runs a plastic bracket with the battery positive wire clipped in the top and the O2 sensor wire clipped into the bottom. Then at the aft end of this bracket, behind it where you cannot see, is the O2 connector and the side-stand safety switch wire runs through as well.

    My OCD would not allow for me to leave this in place and crack the filter, knowing that the oil from the filter would drain all across this. It requires removing a couple of screws, detaching the connectors and moving everything, but as I learned later, it is totally worth the time and if you don’t do it, oil gets into everything. More on that later.

    OK, so now the oil is drained and the filter is off. The filter drained down the case as predicted, but it was an easy clean up with all the other parts out of the way. I had confirmed through my Triumph dealer that the oil filter on the Speedy 1200 is the same as my 2015 Street Triple RX, and the same that Triumph has used for years, Triumph P/N# T1218001. I have a stash of the Amsoil equivalent oil filter, Amsoil P/N# EAOM103. I have used these filters for years and based on the tech data and my research, they are my filter of choice.

    New Amsoil filter went on, thin film of oil applied to rubber sealing gasket and torqued to spec of 10nm. I swapped out the factory drain plug for a Moto-D drain plug, P/N# MD-DRAIN-BOLT-3, which has a flush magnet in the end. Quick aside here…..I have used the Moto-D drain plug in the past and really like them due to their light weight, flush end magnet and the head is cross drilled for safety wire. For some reason I ended up with a Goldplug magnetic drain plug on my 2015 Street Triple, which I think I received as a gift, the plug not the bike. That plug is also made quite well and is a stainless body and good magnet. What I did not like about it was the head is not cross drilled and that little project only took me a couple of hours and a bunch of small drill bits to get through. Moving on…
     

    Attached Files:

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  2. pilot3

    pilot3 New Member

    May 28, 2021
    24
    3
    Spokane, WA
    #2 pilot3, Jun 26, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2021
    Continued:

    Drain plug and new crush washer installed and torqued to 25nm, done. Added 3.3l of Amsoil 10W-40 motorcycle oil, checked the sight glass, all good, and capped it off. OK, so now the bike was left to sit for a bit, as in days. As I said, it was on my lift, another bike was parked behind it and as this was my evening project, I didn’t want to upset the neighbors by running the bike at 11pm inside the garage. To be clear, the fact that my bike now would be sitting for days before I ran the engine had NO bearing on the outcome.

    So the next day I strip the plastics, send them off to CA, and then surgery. Knee all fixed up and I’m back in the garage a few days later. Pull the wheels, install TPMS sensors, reinstall tires and balance them up and get the bike all back together. This takes a few days since I was trying to lay low.

    Finally I have the bike all back together just awaiting the plastics. I take it off the lift and roll it outside to give what is left of it a bath from all the bugs post my last ride. Once she’s clean it dawns on me that I should run it post oil change. My expectation was that it would behave just like my Street Triple, fire up and within a second or two, oil pressure light would extinguish. Nothing doing.,

    Fired her up and first I saw the little oil pressure symbol just staying illuminated and a second or two later the big NO OIL PRESSURE alert took over half the TFT display. Shut down time and off to the computer.

    My search brings up only one really helpful link which was on this site:

    https://www.thetriumphforum.com/thr...-triple-rs-500-mile-oil-change-problem.14166/

    His bike is a 2018 Speedy. You can read through his post but the short version is Triumph acknowledged that on some of those bikes an air vacuum would occur causing this same issue. Ultimately Triumph issued a new procedure for changing the oil on those bikes. The new procedure is as follows:

    Bike on side stand
    Drain oil
    Remove filter
    Refit drain plug
    *Fill oil with 3.2l - out of normal order
    Install new filter
    Start and idle
    Check and top off level

    That is the quick synopsis. So based on what I am seeing on my bike, I am thinking this is a likely reason for my issue. Also, at this point, when I would tap on my filter that is on the bike, it sounded hollow, like it was empty (which it was).

    So I run down to my dealer and pick up a new Triumph branded filter. I wanted to Triumph filter to be on there because in case this did not resolve my problem, I didn’t want them to be able to give me any reason to deny my warranty claim. Go back home, put my bike on the side stand this time and pull the drain plug, dumping my new oil into a clean pan. Since I thought the filter was empty, I decided to risk spinning it off without undoing all the wiring underneath it this time. I figured if it started to drip as I was removing the filter, I would jus tighten it up quickly and then remove everything.

    I get the filter off and yes, it was bone dry. The entire housing was just as it was when I had installed the Amsoil filter. Per the “new procedure”, I had the bike on the side stand and had drained the oil and removed the filter. I refit the drain plug with yet another new crush washer and went to fill the engine with my oil.

    As I began pouring the oil in, I heard some dribbling. OF course I know what this is. Stop filling, go around the bike and see that about 1/4 cup of oil has come out of the center return tube, but that was all. But 1/4 cup still drained through all the wiring and made a huge mess since it invades everything.

    I take pause with my refilling and disassemble all the wiring and brackets again and clean it all up. It should be noted here that the oil got completely into the body and seams of the electrical connector for the O2 sensor. That was a PITA to clean up. My big take away from this design is the following: I am super OCD and having oil infiltrate this just bothers me. I also believe that there would be very few technicians with the time or patience to disassemble all of this for a simple oil change. So, if you are taking your bike to the dealer for your oil changes, make sure you don’t have residual oil here that is going to get hot and leech out and go everywhere on your first ride home. Another reason to do your own service if you can.

    Now to finish the oil change. The above burp of oil coming out of the filter stem gave me great hope that this was going to fix my problem. Sounds logical, there was an air bubble in the system somewhere and by having the filter off, that burp of oil was it moving through. I finished the fill, spun on the new Triumph branded filter and was ready to go again.

    Fired the bike up and she behaved exactly the same way. NO OIL PRESSURE on the TFT. Shut her down and time to call the dealer. Spoke with the Service Manager and provided all the details. She puts me on hold and speaks with the tech who advises that there is no special procedure that he knows of and he does every oil change the same way as was outlined in the manuals and I had done the first time. They also asked if I was pre-filling the oil filter. This issue was addressed on the 2018 model and makes no difference on that bike, but it is possible to do since the 1050 motor has the filter install vertically. I had to explain some basic physics to the service manager in that the 1200 motor has the filter install horizontally so there were some gravitational issues at play making pre-filling the filter not practical.

    So the Service Manager tells me she will reach out to Triumph in the morning and get back to me. The next morning, I get a call back and am told the following:
    1. Triumph has no “special procedure” for changing oil on any of their bikes. I called BS on that.
    2. They were telling me to confirm the oil was full, start the bike and give it two mild revs and the oil pressure light would extinguish.
    3. If the light did not extinguish, the bike needs to go to the dealer for service.
    So I confirm with the service manager that she is directing me to start my bike yet again, rev it twice and see what happens and that if things go south, it was on them. Yup, that is what I am supposed to do. I will mention here that I was not too paranoid about these minor engine runs. The bike shipped with good quality synthetic oil and there is so much research and data available about the quality of synthetic oil protection, I was not too concerned this would cause an issue. Additionally, the different runs of the engine were so far apart there was not much heat generated.

    Out to the garage, fire up the bike, rev rev, and no joy again. Lots of profanity this time and seeing the potential for my not taking this bike on my trip becoming a reality. Call the service manager back and they make arrangements to come pick up the bike.

    Later that afternoon, I get a call from the technician. He tells me that yes, he had to run the bike once just to see that the issue still existed. Once he did that, he told me he removed the clutch cover to confirm everything looked good with the chain drive, which it did. I know he had to do this but we would have had to have some incredible interplanetary alignment for that chain to have taken a dump at the exact moment I arrived home from my ride to have never worked again.
     
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  3. pilot3

    pilot3 New Member

    May 28, 2021
    24
    3
    Spokane, WA
    Continued:

    So then the tech tells me he has someone else come over to the bike to start it for him. He said he spun the oil filter off so it wasn’t making contact with the sealing surface and they fired up the bike. That did it. He said the pressure light immediately extinguished and at the same time, oil came gushing out of the filter housing at which point he spun the filter on tight. And you are correct, he had not disassembled any of the wiring and bracketry under the oil filter so of course that is all covered in oil now.

    I asked him if this is going to be my new oil change procedure and unfortunately it probably is. The system is sealed so well, that yes, it creates an air lock within and the pump pickup cannot start moving oil until it can purge itself. I did not ask him if he had considered just removing the oil fill cap to vent the air but that is clearly what I will try at my next oil change before I try the filter.

    The technician told me he sprayed down the engine and all the wiring and cleared it up for me, and then ran the bike until the cooling fan came on to burn off anything he missed and the bike had no issues. He was going to program my TPMS and I am headed to pick up the bike today.

    The tech also asked me about the other oil change procedure I had discovered about the 2018-20 models. He said when he called Triumph they told him the same thing, that there are no special procedures for oil changes on any of their bikes. I explained that I think the communication issues between Triumph UK and USA are likely as similar as communication would be between Ducati and Honda. He asked I send the document to him, which I did, so he could present it to Triumph.

    So there you have it. I’ll get the bike in a couple of hours and if anything needs updating, I’ll add it in here. I don’t complain about the design of the oil filter on this bike with how the wires run underneath it since oil changes are a once, maybe twice a year thing for me. I don’t mind the extra work to keep things tidy. I appreciate all the design elements of the bike and how Triumph does take care to hide cables and wires and keep things pretty streamlined, and I think they did a good job with this bike as they did with my Street. That filter is far more convenient to drain and remove but it is also on the front of the motor which could present different issues. Nothing is perfect but the 1200 in general is a well designed machine.

    Finally, I am dealing with an unresolved Bluetooth issue with my iPhone X and the navigation feature. I can connect my phone and Sena comm system and that works flawlessly. It will not connect the nav feature at all. Evidently this is not a Speedy issue, since they have a customer here with a new Tiger 900 that has the same problem. Of course Triumph USA says this is news to them, although a simple forum search shows this issue going back to the introduction of the MyTriumph app and the 2018-2020 bikes across the range.

    Sorry for the long story, but knowing how dealers and manufacturers are, I wanted to have exactly how and what I did to be out there in case someone else needs help with the same issue.

    Attached is the Triumph bulletin for the 2018-20 Speed Triple as well.

    p3
     
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  4. pilot3

    pilot3 New Member

    May 28, 2021
    24
    3
    Spokane, WA
    Reserved
     
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  5. m4ppy

    m4ppy Well-Known Member

    Aug 7, 2013
    52
    68
    Great write up and glad I don’t service my bikes any more (with having warranty the rules in the UK are different). I have a 1200 RS with the same nav issues and spoke to my triumph and they confirmed it’s to be fixed with a bike update end of the summer.
     
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  6. Barryscott

    Barryscott Member

    Jul 7, 2018
    54
    18
    Tupelo, Ms, USA
    please keep us updated. Hope to have a 1200RS shortlly
     
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  7. speed triple newbie

    speed triple newbie New Member

    Sep 23, 2021
    0
    1
    serverna park md
     
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  8. speed triple newbie

    speed triple newbie New Member

    Sep 23, 2021
    0
    1
    serverna park md
    Hello any updates ? The bulletin looks like the older triple with filter underneath by the sump . I just grabbed a filter and oil at dealer and was warned be careful or you’ll blow your motor up not what I’m used to hearing for a oil change
     
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  9. pilot3

    pilot3 New Member

    May 28, 2021
    24
    3
    Spokane, WA
    Unfortunately no more info. Dealer could never tell me anything more and after 4K miles on the beast, and that I also have a Street Triple, I sold her.
     
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  10. xorbe

    xorbe Senior Member

    Jan 27, 2021
    118
    143
    CA, USA
    I got the big warning message on the dash on my first oil change @ 599, so I immediately turned the bike off after giving it a couple 3k blips. I tilted the bike one way for a bit, then the other. No warnings on the second start. Maybe I got lucky, I dunno.
     
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  11. Cap'n Dave

    Cap'n Dave Well-Known Member

    Dec 9, 2021
    18
    53
    Griffin, GA
    I am looking at doing my first oil change soon. At that time, I want to replace the drain bolt with a magnetic option. You listed MD-DRAIN-BOLT-2 as the one that you purchased. The Moto-D site says that is a M14-1.25 thread pitch. I thought that the 2022 Triumph Speed 1200 is a M14-1.5 thread pitch. Just wanting to make sure that I order the correct item.
     
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  12. pilot3

    pilot3 New Member

    May 28, 2021
    24
    3
    Spokane, WA
    You are correct on the pitch. I just went and searched for my prior order and I did not make it from Moto-D directly. And the part number I listed didn't come up on their site when I just tried it, so I am thinking it was from whatever site I used.

    So for accuracy, yes, you want an M14-1.5 pitch bolt magnetic drain plug. On the Moto-D site it is the MD-DRAIN-BOLT-3. Link here: https://www.motodracing.com/moto-d-magnetic-drain-bolt-m14x1.5x16

    (I corrected the original post as well, thanks for the info Cap'n Dave!)
     
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  13. Cap'n Dave

    Cap'n Dave Well-Known Member

    Dec 9, 2021
    18
    53
    Griffin, GA
    Great. Just ordered mine. Thank you for the great write up and the information.
     
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  14. pilot3

    pilot3 New Member

    May 28, 2021
    24
    3
    Spokane, WA
    And on an unrelated note, I'll throw this on here quickly, with the short story behind it.....

    When I got the bike, I promptly put the initial miles on it so I could do the break in service. Fast forward through all the above, I was leaving for a 3k mile trip immediately thereafter, on a Tuesday. Well the Friday before is when I get the bike back from my dealer after the oil filter fiasco and I am tidying her up when I notice the master link on the chain has a bad crimp. From the factory.

    Basically one of the pins the flare tool slipped off and pushed the crimp sideways across there plate and there was a gap around half of the pin that was never crimped and I could see the gap between the pin and the hole.

    I call my dealer to see if they have a spare master link in stock. Nope. So, the chain is RK, I call RK in CA and talk with them since there are no identifying marks on the chain as to which series of chain it is for me to order a spare link. No joy. Per RK, this is a Triumph spec'd chain and the are just contracted to build it for Triumph, so spare links have to come from Triumph.

    Not wanting to risk the 3k mile ride with this half and poorly crimped link, I called Sprocketcenter ordered myself a new ZVMX chain with link, figuring I'd swap the chain and hold this one as a replacement at a later date. Chain arrived next day and was installed.

    Since then I have traded off the bike. If anyone wants to cover the $10 for shipping, and source a new master link from Triumph, I will send the chain along to you. Heres a pic:

    [​IMG]

    PM me for it please.
     
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  15. Dasheng

    Dasheng New Member

    Dec 28, 2021
    6
    3
    Greece
    Thanks for all the info.
    I have a brand new Speed triple 12000rs with 224klm on it that gave me the low oil pressure warning and it's at the service store now. I hope it goes well.
     
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  16. ir0ns

    ir0ns New Member

    Mar 1, 2022
    2
    3
    US - TN
    Hi All,

    Just joined the forum and wanted to say thanks to those that shared their findings and experience with this issue. I recently purchased a new 2022 Speed Triple RS and mine is also exhibiting the low oil pressure light. Both times the light came on I shut the engine off immediately, verified oil level and fired the engine back up, and each time the low pressure condition was gone. I have verified oil level is adequate, filter is snug, and there are no apparent drips or spots of oil under the bike. Other than the error light, there was no other signs that something was wrong. I'm planning to have my Triumph dealer service the bike today in response to this and will follow-up to share their findings.

    Thanks!
     
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  17. Antonis Vlamis

    Antonis Vlamis New Member

    Feb 27, 2022
    2
    3
    Athens - Greece

    Any news??? I am having exactly the same issue and I am afraid that bike is in danger of a serious problem…
     
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  18. ir0ns

    ir0ns New Member

    Mar 1, 2022
    2
    3
    US - TN
    Antonis -

    So the dealer finally got back to me and said that they were able to rule out any issue with the pressure sensor and/or anything electrical. They manually checked the oil pressure and according to the service manager, it was low, but not out of the allowable range that Triumph has specified, not sure what that range is exactly. The dealer also compared the oil pressure on my RS to a new 1200RR and found that the RR had better oil pressure throughout the rev range.

    The only recourse now is to replace the oil pump -- so now my bike is stuck at the dealer for the foreseeable future waiting on an oil pump that is on backorder.
     
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  19. Antonis Vlamis

    Antonis Vlamis New Member

    Feb 27, 2022
    2
    3
    Athens - Greece
    #19 Antonis Vlamis, Mar 15, 2022
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2022
    Thank you for your response. Today I had a conversation with my triumph dealer and he told me that they have checked several bikes with this type of issue and they found no problem, that is a software issue and that triumph is going to release a software update. He told me also that he is going to change oil valve.
     
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  20. Dasheng

    Dasheng New Member

    Dec 28, 2021
    6
    3
    Greece
    Antonis are you in Greece?
     
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