Hi all, I recently had the misfortune to suffer a sudden loss of oil, most of which ended up on the rear tyre, (very lucky that I didn't spin out, but I don't feel so lucky at present). I didn't see the oil light come on but when I noticed it I slowed, pulled over to a (relatively) safe spot and killed the engine as it was just about to seize. After cleaning off the oil, I set about looking for where it had come from, there was none above the sump and the oil line and unions looked good. I pulled the oil filter as it was still dripping from that and noticed that the oil was seeping from the brazed on nut. This is a K&N filter with only 5 months/2000 miles on it. I have done a bit of research and found this has happened to others (exact same deal with the brazed nut) and that there is a warranty on K&N covering damage caused by failure. My questions are: Has anybody been through this before, what was the outcome as regards K&N warranty. And, I am prob'ly gonna do the engine repair myself but have not looked inside as yet, so what would you do first? The engine turns freely with plugs out using rear wheel in gear. I have ordered a new filter and oil, so will try and turn her over (without plugs), then try and fire her up. What should I be looking/listening for? Should I do anything else before I try this? The bike is a low mileage 2010 Bonnie SE, any advice welcomed, and thank you to the few bikers who stopped to ask if all was O.K whilst I waited 2 hours on a cold mountain for the R.A.C.
I would think the warranty only applies if you have proof that the filter was fitted by a fully trained technician. Hopefully your engine will be okay if you caught it quickly enough, but it is worrying until you get the bike running again. It sounds like you know what you are doing so just listen to the engine at different rev bands and ride on some well known to you roads to see if you can detect any sluggishness or 'noises' I would definitely pursue a claim with K&N but be prepared for loads of small print. As DD has said in the previous post, it is suspected that fakes are on the market. Good luck mate
Yes I saw the thread before asking for advice here, and read a couple of items on TriumphRat. Filter was bought from K&N U.K as I had heard about fakes, so all genuine and kept receipt. I fitted the filter and (as I was once a mechanic) tightened by hand as per; i.e did not use nut, and def did not overtighten. Filter never leaked a drop from day one until the failure, which forced opened the flange around the nut. I'll never use another filter with a nut brazed to it, once bitten.
I am competent mechanically but never had to deal with a suspected seizure before. Just wondered if there were any tips or wrinkles to establish the amount of damage before either starting up the engine or dismantling. I know I can get the oil analysed for metal particles . . . . . . . anything else?
O.K New oil and filter and restarted. Engine turns freely enough, no reluctance to starting up, ticks over on first choke setting but that's where the good news ends. There is a pronounced metallic tap from somewhere near the top end, will pull the plugs and check, then will start to take off head and barrels. Any ideas anyone?
Most probably camshaft / valves You will need to strip down the top end as planned, if it is only tapping it may be that some adjustments can be made. May be no damage, fingers crossed. Read up on the K&N warranty though before stripping the engine, as you may void any claim if you are intending going that route. My gut feeling is that they would supply you with a new filter only, which you would probably not want to use due to this failure. Not good at all, particularly when you have fitted it yourself with no excessive tightening of the nut portion.
You can see in the photo below, there are 12 or so spot brazes (or something similar?) and the flange carrying the nut has parted company with the main filter body from the 9 O'clock position to the 12 O'clock position. I have a returns order from K&N as they obviously need to see it. Meantime I got photos, and video of it leaking, am off to show the local motorcycle repair the filter, and ask him for an estimate, before I send it back.
Yes, exactly. I changed it myself and logged the date and mileage in my Haynes. It's been on since Sept 12, 2016, and done less than 3000 miles. The marks on the side is where I used a grab tool to get it off as I didn't want to touch the nut in case it muddied the waters for later investigations. I was a little shocked at the amount of corrosion too, considering the age and mileage.
It certainly doesnt look new! if I was guessing from the photograph I would say a good few years old ??? What year was it fitted ? Another disadvantage with the nut style of filter is the slightly reduced ground clearance and the possibility of the nut taking a knock.
Well done DD, very worrying. Have you had chance to do any destructive torque testing yet, because it now looks like you will have to do the several different types of nut fixing. Look at the Date of Manufacture of all your filters and tie them to the country of manufacture. If K&N have made changes to their method of manufacturing it should have been standardised across all their suppliers. Obviously they will still want to sell their old stock, which is why you may be seeing the differences, there should be a date for the standardised process change if it has been implemented correctly Companies like K&N with high volume manufacturing are always looking at reducing costs, so it is inevitable that changes to the product will occur, but not to the detriment of the products basic function.
Well i guess if we don't see your results on the forum means that K&N have offered a payment and you've accepted K&N's offer of a payment to keep your "shocking results" quiet from their customers. So, I aint buying any more cos if we see them we'll be shocked and if we don't K&N don't want us to be shocked! Just make sure you get enough money to help us poor deprived K&N customers drown our sorrows at the GMU
Yes I fully understand DD, you don't want to be costing yourself any money to do comparison tests, plus ideally you would need to do a minimum of 5 filters of each type and take the average for the tests to have any credibility. This thread has taken an interesting turn but it does not surprise me due to the constant desire for companies to source cheaper and cheaper suppliers. False economy in the long run, losing customers like yourself through penny pinching accountants controlling reputable companies.
To put it simply, some clever twat at K&N has come up with a cost saving idea that has set £ signs spinning in the eyes of the Accountants. It would be interesting to see if there was any Quality Control documentation relating to the engineering changes.
www.st-owners.com/forums/showthread.php?115338-Problems-with-K...Oil-Filters seems like this is not a new problem
Really sad to see this cost reduction putting our lives at risk! I have used K&N but if this is the quality of a 'premium' brand than I shall be looking elswhere. What is a good alternative?
